Curse

Haggard · Apr 01, 2006, 12:31 AM // 00:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eldin

~Will the Charr EVER give up?

Doubt it, as beasts of war with no conscience, I don't think they'll settle for a measly draw.

ETSubmariner · Apr 05, 2006, 01:56 AM // 01:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Haggard

Doubt it, as beasts of war with no conscience, I don't think they'll settle for a measly draw.

Oops, careful. Beasts? No conscience? You must be reading the history books written by the conquerors. I don't think the Charr are less advanced or less 'humane' than any other race, and its possible they were pushed back from their normal homelands by humans in bygone days.

Humans aren't always right.

kryshnysh · Apr 07, 2006, 03:15 PM // 15:15

I would say the "Beasts" stereotype has a better basis in the story than the equivalent to other races theory. Never really hear the Charr speak, the wall was made to defend against them, they go out of their way to invade Kryta, and Orr, they kidnap and kill civilians.

As far as the Charr, it seems reasonable to suppose that they have been advancing or fighting back and forth with the humans for several years before the Searing. It may be possible that Drascir fell during the Searing, but it does seem like Drascir and even Nolani are north of the Great Wall...

Before Rurik fled, the humans were winning some and losing some battles, Rin burned but wasn't captured, the humans took Piken square, and were invaded and then repulsed the invaders from Ranik. If Adelbern is able to penetrate into Charr territory to fight off the Titans, then he seems to have survived through the latter 4/5 of the game, and not lost even the frontier gate to the Charr. In addition, Grendich Courthouse is still under human control when doing the Titan Source, so they still have some outpost far enough north to be inside Charr territory. Looks to me like Ascalon is at the least holding steady, and only the arrival of the titans made doom seem immediate. I personally don't mind fighting the Charr, and side with Adelbern in the Rurik v. Adelbern arguments, so maybe I'm more partial to Ascalon, but most of us are partial one way or another.

I think Kryta is really the only strong human kingdom left in the land.

I think the Stone Summit seem to be weaker than it might appear from how many we have to battle. If they held 90% of the Shiverpeaks (as it might appear from all the battles we have with them), they would have taken the few remaining outposts by now given the lack of guards in those outposts. However I can think of two "towns" that the Summit control, and the rest could just be bad luck in our running into them. The two "towns" being Sorrow's Furnace and what seems to be more of a town in southeastern Tasca's Demise.

The Deldrimor Dwarves control Thunderhead Keep and town, Droknar's Forge, Port Sledge, many towns up north (including Maladar's Fort and Grooble's Gulch which are not map-travel accessible). The possible town in the Deldrimor Bowl (could be a Centaur town, I think this is somewhat debatable), the town south of the Ice Tooth Cave (where frostfyre dryders like to attack when you try to walk into it), and so on. Seems to be a lot of towns under Deldrimor Control. Where are all the Dwarves? There have to be more Dwarves, but I'm not really sure where they are, maybe not in the towns solely to avoid excessive graphics and data transfer issues. Their troops seem weak most of the time, but that would indicate numbers are on their side (or they should be crushed far too easily). Maybe thats just because we fight the only summit (said in the lore manual that all are battle tested/hardened, etc.), whereas there are many Deldrimor Dwarves around and always newer recruits.

I agree with Eldin on the Shining Blade. Denravi is their capital even for the titan quests, and thus wasn't left behind. It may not be that large (growing to be large in such a short period of time seems nearly impossible), but it isn't a tiny outpost either.

My main difference though seems to be a difference in population views. I see outposts and even wild areas as having unseen friends and allies, such that the populatin of "bad guys" doesn't outnumber "good guys" but rather the other way around. If we presume that "baddies" outnumber the "good guys" and we're the only thing saving the world, the outlook is pretty bleak, but I think you can see some of my arguments as to why "good guys" outnumber "baddies" from my Summit vs. Deldrimor arguments.

Dalnor Ironhelm · Apr 10, 2006, 09:55 PM // 21:55

What about the undead? Surely they weren't all destroyed with the demise of Vizier. Without a leader or someone/something to control them, wouldn't they be a force to be dealt with in eastern/northeastern Kryta, albeit an un-organized force?